What We Can Learn from Taylor Swift

You're listening to Women at Work from Harvard Business Review. I'm Amy Gallo, here with Maureen Hoch, who's the editor of hbr.org and who has a book recommendation for us. Hi, Amy. Hi, Maureen. So my recommendation is a new book from our colleague, Kevin Evers, who's a senior editor here at HBR, and it is called There's Nothing Like This, the strategic genius of Taylor Swift. I have to tell you, I'm very proud to work for an outlet that has published a book I I know. With Taylor Swift. And and so here's a question for you, actually. Yeah. What do you know of the strategic genius of Taylor Swift? As the mom of a teenager, when I hear Taylor Swift's name, I get a little disappointed that I didn't raise a Swiftie because I felt like that was gonna be my entree into her. So I haven't been as much into her music as I sort of want to be, although folklore did get me through some dark pandemic times. But I have been a real keen observer as someone who thinks about women and work and have just always been impressed with her career and how she manages her brand and herself. And, of course, it's hard to miss the controversy and the shade thrown her way, and she just always bounces back and always continues to build this amazing business. So how did you get into Taylor Swift? Yeah. So Is Irene a Swifty? Irene, my daughter, my 10 year old daughter. I don't know if she'd call herself a Swifty, but she does have a lot of interest in and admiration for Taylor Swift. And I think one of the things that Taylor does well is she knows how to hit a moment. Right? Yeah. You know? She's got a really good sense of timing. When she was on SNL and did the ten minute version of All too well. Mhmm. I sat with two friends and watched that. We were just so fascinated by her and Yeah. The spectacle of it all, and she killed it. Well, and Harper Hoot, my daughter who's not a Swifty, made us sit down and watch that one. Yeah. Yeah. I have to say her strategic genius was really so clarified for me when my mom, who's almost 80 Mhmm. Sometime over the past year during I think it was toward the end of the ARRIS tour, said to me, do you know who I have a lot of respect for? And I said, who, mom? And she said, Taylor Swift. And I thought, oh, man. Taylor is doing something right to be able to reach your 10 year old daughter, to reach us as middle aged women, and to reach my mom. It's amazing. I haven't read the book yet. Mhmm. It's on my list. But tell me what Kevin how he captures what's so smart about her approach. So, I mean, I like that it …