20Product: Why Most CPOs are Bad | Why You Do Not Need PMs in a World of AI | Why the Design Stage is Dead and How to Use Vibe Coding to Replace It | The Three Roles All Founders End Up Firing on Repeat with Jason James @ Tezi

Are listening to 20 Product with me, Harry Stebbings. Now, 20 Product is a show where we dive into the best product minds in Silicon Valley to unveil how they think about building product teams, managing PMs in a world of AI, how they build the best products and product teams today. Now we're joined today by one of the best, Jason James, cofounder of Tezi and one of the leading product minds in the valley. Prior to Tezi, Jason was the VP of product at Instacart leading up to their IPO. And before that, he was the head of product and design at Thumbtack. But before we dive into the show today, are you struggling to beat model benchmarks or implement gen AI in your product? If so, you need Turing. Turing is an AGI infrastructure company backed by incredible investors like Foundation Capital and Westbridge Capital, and they do two things. Number one, they help leading companies in AI labs like Salesforce, Anthropic, and Meta enhance their LLMs with advanced reasoning, coding, multilinguality, multimodality, and more? Number two, they combine human and artificial intelligence expertise to deploy cutting edge AI systems for awesome companies like Rivian and Reddit. Right now, Turing offers a free five minute self assessment to help you pinpoint your place in the Gen AI journey, get tailored next steps to optimize your model strategy, and then finally, learn how Turing can refine and implement your models for better performance. Take the guesswork out of Gen AI. Visit turing.com/20vc to start your free assessment today. And once your Gen AI strategy is on strategy is on point with Turing You have now arrived at your destination. Jason, I am so excited for this dude. I've been looking forward to this one all day. So thank you so much for joining me first. Yeah. Really happy to be here. Thanks for having me. Now I wanna start a little bit before Tazzie. And I wanna start with you've been at some of the most incredible organizations from your Instacarts to your Thumbtacks. If we start breaking them apart actually with Instacart, when we think about big lessons learned, what was your biggest product lesson learned from the days at Instacart? Biggest product lesson learned from Instacart was as much as AB testing and like high velocity optimizations feel like progress. And to some extent, they will be when you're at a business of that scale, where we're talking like 30 to 40,000,000,000 in gross transaction volume. The only thing that really moves the needle is like new capabilities. So we would try and test a lot throughout the customer experience to optimize conversion, make things easier, make search better, the results more relevant, and it would deliver wins. But the sleeper huge win was when we launched snap EBT, which is like food stamps, to be able to pay with those on Instacart. It became a billion dollar business line in less than a year and …