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The Psychology Podcast

203: Creating a Living Masterpiece with Michael Gervais

63 min episode · 3 min read
·

Episode

63 min

Read time

3 min

Topics

Productivity, Relationships, Leadership

AI-Generated Summary

Key Takeaways

  • Compete to Create Philosophy: The Latin origin of competition means to strive together, not beat others. The framework prioritizes being present first, then letting doing flow from that state. This requires commanding inner self, mastering craft, staying present, and embracing vulnerability. Athletes skilled at being themselves in unpredictable environments outperform those focused solely on outcomes. The philosophy extends to relationships with self, others, and nature.
  • FOPO as Performance Constrictor: Fear of People's Opinions represents one of the greatest constrictors of human potential in modern times. Ancient brains evolved to detect environmental threats like predators, but now interpret social judgment as existential danger. Social media amplifies this by constantly displaying others' highlight reels. Stage fright exemplifies FOPO - the only real risk is others' judgment. Recognizing this pattern allows performers to separate actual threats from perceived social consequences.
  • Building Authentic Confidence: Confidence comes from one source - what you say to yourself, rooted in credible evidence of doing difficult things. Coaches saying just be confident or just relax represent unskilled guidance. The trainable skill involves earning the right to tell yourself I can do difficult things through deliberate practice in challenging environments. Confidence does not depend on past success but on developing mental skills to generate calmness and self-belief independent of external validation.
  • Philosophy as Unshakeable Foundation: Pete Carroll got fired twice from NFL jobs before writing his philosophy in spiral notebooks, committing to full authenticity at USC. Once you know who you are through this discovery process, no external experience - wins, losses, sneers, or even cancel culture - can take that understanding away. The powerful work involves getting clear on your philosophy through structured reflection. This clarity precedes trusting yourself in unpredictable situations.
  • Four Core Mental Skills: The essential mental skills for high performance include optimism, confidence, calmness, and deep focus. These represent trainable abilities, not innate traits. Performers should identify which skills need development and back into specific training protocols. The invisible nature of psychology makes it tricky to notice internal changes, requiring deliberate practice combining science-backed methods with tangible takeaway tools. Mastering these four creates the foundation for accessing craft under pressure.

What It Covers

High performance psychologist Michael Gervais discusses his framework for thriving under pressure, developed over twenty years working with NFL Seattle Seahawks, Olympic medalists, and corporate leaders. He explains the Compete to Create philosophy with coach Pete Carroll, emphasizing being over doing, managing fear of people's opinions, and building mental skills for consequential environments through their Audible original book.

Key Questions Answered

  • Compete to Create Philosophy: The Latin origin of competition means to strive together, not beat others. The framework prioritizes being present first, then letting doing flow from that state. This requires commanding inner self, mastering craft, staying present, and embracing vulnerability. Athletes skilled at being themselves in unpredictable environments outperform those focused solely on outcomes. The philosophy extends to relationships with self, others, and nature.
  • FOPO as Performance Constrictor: Fear of People's Opinions represents one of the greatest constrictors of human potential in modern times. Ancient brains evolved to detect environmental threats like predators, but now interpret social judgment as existential danger. Social media amplifies this by constantly displaying others' highlight reels. Stage fright exemplifies FOPO - the only real risk is others' judgment. Recognizing this pattern allows performers to separate actual threats from perceived social consequences.
  • Building Authentic Confidence: Confidence comes from one source - what you say to yourself, rooted in credible evidence of doing difficult things. Coaches saying just be confident or just relax represent unskilled guidance. The trainable skill involves earning the right to tell yourself I can do difficult things through deliberate practice in challenging environments. Confidence does not depend on past success but on developing mental skills to generate calmness and self-belief independent of external validation.
  • Philosophy as Unshakeable Foundation: Pete Carroll got fired twice from NFL jobs before writing his philosophy in spiral notebooks, committing to full authenticity at USC. Once you know who you are through this discovery process, no external experience - wins, losses, sneers, or even cancel culture - can take that understanding away. The powerful work involves getting clear on your philosophy through structured reflection. This clarity precedes trusting yourself in unpredictable situations.
  • Four Core Mental Skills: The essential mental skills for high performance include optimism, confidence, calmness, and deep focus. These represent trainable abilities, not innate traits. Performers should identify which skills need development and back into specific training protocols. The invisible nature of psychology makes it tricky to notice internal changes, requiring deliberate practice combining science-backed methods with tangible takeaway tools. Mastering these four creates the foundation for accessing craft under pressure.
  • Double Barreled Shotgun Mindset: Olympic gold medalist Karch Kiraly states nobody wins gold without facing down a double barreled shotgun. This fundamental commitment means preparing for real challenges daily rather than avoiding difficulty. When stress hits, untrained people unlock arms and abandon the team. Trained performers stay connected, viewing challenges as feedback loops about their ability to be themselves while maintaining relationships. Embracing this mindset transforms how average people engage with difficult situations.

Notable Moment

Gervais challenges the hierarchy of human experience by asking whether Genghis Khan, Hitler, and Bin Laden were good leaders. He argues they organized their lives fundamentally toward their north star with the same commitment as positive leaders, just with destructive aims. This reframes leadership and optimization as value-neutral skills that can serve any purpose, highlighting why defining your north star matters more than simply pursuing excellence.

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Episode Transcript

Welcome to the Psychology Podcast, where we give you insights into the mind, brain, behavior, and creativity. I'm doctor Scott Barry Kaufman. And in each episode, I have a conversation with a guest who will stimulate your mind and give you a greater understanding of yourself, others, and the world we live in. Hopefully, we'll also provide a glimpse into human possibility. Thanks for listening, and enjoy the podcast. Today, it's great to have Michael Gervais on the podcast. Doctor Gervais is a world renowned high performance psychologist and industry visionary. Over the course of twenty years working with world leading performers, doctor Gervais has developed a psychological framework that allows people to thrive in pressure packed environments. His clientele consists of the NFL Seattle Seahawks, countless Olympic medalists, MVPs from every major sport, world record holders, internationally acclaimed music artists, and corporate leaders. Doctor Gervais is a host of the popular Finding Mastery Podcast that explores the psychology of some of the world's most extraordinary thinkers and doers. Doctor Gervais and NFL coach Pete Carroll founded Compete to Create, an online and live master class for the mind. They have worked with more than 3,000 employees at Microsoft alone on the mental skills and strategies to unleash one's potential. Doctor Gervais and Pete Carroll have coauthored the recently released Audible original called Compete to Create. Also, Gervais is a published peer reviewed author and recognized speaker on optimal human performance. He's been featured by NBC, ABC, FOX, CNN, ESPN, NFL Network, Wall Street Journal, New York Times, Outside Magazine, Wired, ESPN Magazine, the Harvard Business Review, and others. Was that enough of a bio there, Mike? And I get to be fortunate to be Scott Barry Kaufman's friend. Oh, I love it. Mike, it is so great to have you on the show today, if I may call you Mike. Of course. I've been looking forward to this with you. Been looking forward to it as well. I think it's been maybe a couple years since you've last been on the psychology podcast. Congratulations on everything that you've been putting together, and, it's not lost to me the work that you've invested in in trying to understand understand how to add to the body knowledge of our beautiful field. So well done, mate. Well, thank you. That that really does mean a lot to me. It's nice to have that noticed, that hard work. So let's talk about compete to create. It's an audible book now. I mean, it was a training course, and now you you've turned it with Pete into an audible book. Why audible? Why that format? Well, I'm a fan of listening, as a form of learning. I really like the visual and auditory systems as part of learning. So we've that's why we started the course. And then the reason we wanted to do an audible book, an audible original, as it's called, is as an extension to the podcast experience for people and …

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Books

  • Compete to CreateRecommendedBy guest

    by Michael Gervais

    He explains the Compete to Create philosophy with coach Pete Carroll, emphasizing being over doing, managing fear of people's opinions, and building mental skills for consequential environments through their Audible original book.

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