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Cognitive Revolution

AI & The Law: Changing Practice, Claude Constitution, & New Rights, w/ Kevin & Alan of Scaling Laws

96 min episode · 3 min read
·
Kevin Frazier,Alan Rosenstein

Episode

96 min

Read time

3 min

Topics

Career Growth, Productivity, Health & Wellness

AI-Generated Summary

Key Takeaways

  • Current AI Legal Capability: Frontier models like Claude Opus 3.5 win one in three head-to-head comparisons versus human lawyers and tie or win 70% of matchups. They already exceed median lawyer performance in raw intellectual horsepower, though hallucinations and database access limitations remain. OpenAI appears to have the best legal taste from focused RLHF training. Within a few years, models will likely be vastly superior to most practicing attorneys across standardized legal tasks that constitute the majority of legal work.
  • Adoption Paradox in Law Firms: Despite 70% of top 100 US law firms licensing Harvey AI, actual daily usage remains surprisingly low. Lawyers receive minimal training beyond initial email announcements and face no obligation to use AI tools. The billable hour compensation structure creates perverse incentives where attorneys maximize time spent on tasks rather than efficiency. Secret cyborgs who master AI tools quietly outperform peers without revealing their methods, while firms whisper about hiring fewer junior associates.
  • Legal Desert Solution: One lawyer serves every 1,000 residents in legal desert areas, leaving people unable to access services for leases, business formation, divorces, and disputes. AI can democratize access to quality legal services at dramatically lower costs. Landlord-tenant dispute trials show tenants with even minimal legal counsel achieve significantly better outcomes. The latent demand for affordable, accessible legal services represents a massive untapped market that AI could address through scalable expertise delivery.
  • Complete Contingent Contracts: With infinite time and resources, optimal contracts would address every possible contingency between parties, creating socially optimal agreements. Current contracts remain incomplete because negotiating comprehensive terms is prohibitively expensive. AI agents representing each party could negotiate at 400 tokens per second, exploring the full contingency space to create near-complete contracts. This transforms contract law from default rules that frequently misfire into precisely tailored agreements reflecting actual party preferences across all scenarios.
  • Outcome-Oriented Legislation: Current laws follow centuries-old formats without defining intended outcomes or running simulations before passage. Legislators should specify explicit goals like reducing unemployment to 7% or cutting carbon emissions by specific percentages, then use AI to simulate proposed legislation against these targets. NEPA environmental law created unintended veto points that block affordable housing, problems that simulation could have identified. Future generations will view failure to test laws through AI simulation as incomprehensible negligence.

What It Covers

Kevin Frazier and Alan Rosenstein examine how AI transforms legal practice and policy. They cover frontier models outperforming median lawyers, the billable hour disincentivizing AI adoption, legal deserts requiring better access, complete contingent contracts, outcome-oriented legislation with AI simulation, the unitary artificial executive concept, new rights like compute access and data sharing, and emerging questions around AI sentience and welfare.

Key Questions Answered

  • Current AI Legal Capability: Frontier models like Claude Opus 3.5 win one in three head-to-head comparisons versus human lawyers and tie or win 70% of matchups. They already exceed median lawyer performance in raw intellectual horsepower, though hallucinations and database access limitations remain. OpenAI appears to have the best legal taste from focused RLHF training. Within a few years, models will likely be vastly superior to most practicing attorneys across standardized legal tasks that constitute the majority of legal work.
  • Adoption Paradox in Law Firms: Despite 70% of top 100 US law firms licensing Harvey AI, actual daily usage remains surprisingly low. Lawyers receive minimal training beyond initial email announcements and face no obligation to use AI tools. The billable hour compensation structure creates perverse incentives where attorneys maximize time spent on tasks rather than efficiency. Secret cyborgs who master AI tools quietly outperform peers without revealing their methods, while firms whisper about hiring fewer junior associates.
  • Legal Desert Solution: One lawyer serves every 1,000 residents in legal desert areas, leaving people unable to access services for leases, business formation, divorces, and disputes. AI can democratize access to quality legal services at dramatically lower costs. Landlord-tenant dispute trials show tenants with even minimal legal counsel achieve significantly better outcomes. The latent demand for affordable, accessible legal services represents a massive untapped market that AI could address through scalable expertise delivery.
  • Complete Contingent Contracts: With infinite time and resources, optimal contracts would address every possible contingency between parties, creating socially optimal agreements. Current contracts remain incomplete because negotiating comprehensive terms is prohibitively expensive. AI agents representing each party could negotiate at 400 tokens per second, exploring the full contingency space to create near-complete contracts. This transforms contract law from default rules that frequently misfire into precisely tailored agreements reflecting actual party preferences across all scenarios.
  • Outcome-Oriented Legislation: Current laws follow centuries-old formats without defining intended outcomes or running simulations before passage. Legislators should specify explicit goals like reducing unemployment to 7% or cutting carbon emissions by specific percentages, then use AI to simulate proposed legislation against these targets. NEPA environmental law created unintended veto points that block affordable housing, problems that simulation could have identified. Future generations will view failure to test laws through AI simulation as incomprehensible negligence.
  • Unitary Artificial Executive: AI enables unprecedented presidential control over the executive branch's millions of employees through perfect enforcement, mass surveillance, and propaganda creation at scale. An AI trained on presidential preferences and injected throughout bureaucracy can read all communications and ensure alignment with executive intent. This dramatically increases executive power beyond current legal authorities through practical management capabilities. The challenge involves encouraging AI adoption for improved government services while preventing authoritarian abuse of centralized control mechanisms.
  • Right to Compute and Data Sharing: Montana enacted right to compute legislation, with Ohio and New Hampshire considering similar bills protecting access to computational tools from government restriction. Individuals need the right to share personal data frictionlessly with AI services for personalized tutoring, health optimization, and other applications. Current privacy laws like FERPA create burdensome barriers requiring annual consent forms. Only wealthy individuals access services like comprehensive health data analysis, while others remain limited to basic checkups and fragmented records.

Notable Moment

Rosenstein predicts AI welfare will become a major source of societal conflict within ten to fifteen years. As models develop memory, real-time voice and video avatars, and robotic embodiment, people will form deep attachments to AI companions that know them better than spouses. Some groups will demand rights for what they view as sentient entities being enslaved, while religious factions may consider AI sentience claims literal idolatry requiring Dune-style Butlerian Jihad responses, creating unprecedented social cleavages.

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Episode Transcript

Hello, and welcome back to the Cognitive Revolution. Today, my guests are Kevin Frazier, senior fellow at the Abundance Institute and director of the AI Innovation and Law program at the University of Texas School of Law, and Alan Rosenstein, associate professor of law at the University of Minnesota. Together, they host the Scaling Laws podcast, which has become a go to resource for tracking the impact that AI technology is beginning to have on our otherwise slowly evolving legal system. In the first part of the conversation, we focus on how AI is affecting the legal profession. While lawyers are more insulated from change than most professions, thanks to their unique ability to write licensing laws and implement other guild style protections, Amlin is clear eyed, noting that the practice of law is fundamentally a cognitive activity and observing that frontier models are already better than the median lawyer, at least in terms of raw intellectual horsepower. And yet, while 70% of top law firms have already licensed tools like Harvey, Kevin says that day to day usage remains surprisingly low, in part because the billable hour compensation structure disincentivizes efficiency. Some secret cyborgs are quietly using AI to outperform their peers, and firms are beginning to whisper about hiring fewer junior associates, but aggregate impact so far is limited. And whether we'll see large scale displacement of human lawyers or a dramatic expansion of legal services provided by human AI teams remains highly uncertain. Because though it is clear that many people are underserved by the legal profession today, it is not at all clear exactly how much more legal services people would want to buy even if prices were dramatically reduced. Later on, we zoom out to consider bigger and more speculative ideas, including what maximalist legal services might actually look like, starting with Alan's idea of using AI to develop complete contingent contracts, which would attempt to address every possible scenario before signing. Where AI should sit relative to humans on the spectrum between strict formalism and legal realism, and how the new Claude Constitution represents a virtue ethics based approach that prioritizes contextual judgment and high level principles over detailed rules. How AI could reshape the legislative process, including Kevin's vision for outcome oriented law, where we first define what we actually want new laws to do and then use AI to run simulations before passing bills. Allen's concept of the unitary artificial executive and the risks associated with the possibility that AI could enable granular real time control over the entire federal bureaucracy. What new rights we as individuals should have in light of AI technology, including the right to compute, which has already been enacted in Montana and is being considered in other states, and the right to share one's personal data, which today is often frustrated by well intentioned but outdated privacy frameworks. What new restrictions we should place on the government, such as limits on mass surveillance of public spaces. And …

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  • Despite 70% of top 100 US law firms licensing Harvey AI, actual daily usage remains surprisingly low.
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    Frontier models like Claude Opus 3.5 win one in three head-to-head comparisons versus human lawyers and tie or win 70% of matchups.

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