Is ONCE enough?

This podcast is hosted by transistor dot f m. I think I I said this on Twitter, I think, but I, like, appreciate that 37 signals exists. I appreciate that, like, some folks are out there that they have the even though you often have to say, like, you like, as you put it, Ian, like, you, random bootstrapper, do not have the, like, tools, advantages, you know, recurring revenue to to execute this. Like, I'm glad they're doing it. You know? Like, sometimes it's almost like, it's almost like an art project. Right? It's like a commentary on the state of the software business world, you know, that I'm like, I'm not gonna do that, but I'm glad you're doing it. You know? Yeah. We have assembled a We have assembled a panel here today. We've got Ian Landsman and Tyler Tringas, and we're here to talk about the post SaaS the post SaaS, world of once only payments or buy once. We're gonna talk a lot about the launch of Campfire by thirty seven signals. And, maybe, actually, Tyler, I'll start with you because you had a Twitter video where you were kind of, like, talking through maybe in anticipation of the launch, what you thought might happen. Do you maybe just describe kind of before launch, what were some of your thoughts kind of leading up to it? What did you expect to see from 37 signals and maybe was there any expectation that it that this might become a viable model for more indies? What were what were you kinda thinking? Yeah. I think it's I think it's super interesting. I feel like the 37 signals folks are like, you know, sometimes I think of myself and and kind of all of us a little bit. We're kind of like anthropologists of these, like, you know, Internet SaaS entrepreneurs, kind of like just observing the whole sociology of what's going on. And they're so interesting in the sense that they both, like, often have really good insights about, like, undercurrents of demand, but then they also create it themselves because they have such a big marketing presence and stuff like that. And so it's really interesting. Like, what I was trying to do was to kind of, like, pick apart, like, okay. What are the trends that I think they're just, like, picking up on? And then also what are the things that they are kind of, like, creating within the ecosystem just by virtue of the fact that they are really successful. They've been in the game for a long time, and they're, like, incredible marketers in a lot of ways. I mean, what I appreciated about your kind of thoughts, and I think a lot of people had this. The question was, you know, when thirty seven signals says they're they're introducing a new paradigm, whether it's, we're getting off the cloud or whatever, it's not like that's just for 37 signals. There's this …