20VC: Atlassian CEO on Why Everything is Overvalued & Are We in an AI Bubble | Do Margins Matter & Does Defensibility Exist in an AI World | Is Per Seat Pricing Dead & The Future of Vibe Coding with Mike Cannon-Brookes

Reasonable men sort of live within the boundaries, and so you need unreasonable men to change things and move the world forward. One of the only predictions I think I would make accurately is ten years from now, we'll look back and say, man, you remember that era? That was crazy. Most of the things are vastly overvalued. Five years from now, we'll have more engineers working for our company than we do today, more software developers working for our companies. We will create far more. They will be more efficient. My favorite quote of Tobes is, he once told me that the founder's job is to fight the entropy of ambition. This is twenty VC with me, Harry Stebbings. Now I started twenty VC eleven years ago to have the chance to interview incredible entrepreneurs like the one we have sitting down with us today. He is one of the greats, Mike Cannon Brookes, cofounder and CEO of Atlassian, the $50,000,000,000 software giant behind products like Jira, Confluence, and Trello. Since founding the company in 2002, he's scaled Atlassian to over 300,000 customers, generating more than $5,000,000,000 for the year of 2025 in annual revenue. Atlassian now employs over 10,000 people and is one of the most successful bootstrapped IPO stories in tech history. He's also their super active climate investor and co owner of several major sports teams. This was so much fun for me to do and a real childhood tick the box moment in my journey. But before we dive into the show today, I love seeing the team come together to make this show happen. What I don't love is trying to keep track of all the information, the data, and the projects that we're working on across dozens of platforms, products, and tools. That's why we use Coda, the all in one collaborative workspace that's helped 50,000 teams all over the world get on the same page. Offering the flexibility of docs with the structure of spreadsheets, Coda facilitates deeper teamwork and quicker creativity, and their turnkey AI solution, the intelligence of Coda Brain, is a game changer. Powered by Grammarly, Coda is entering a new phase of innovation and expansion, aiming to redefine productivity for the AI era. Whether you're a start up looking to organize the chaos while staying nimble or an enterprise organization looking for better alignment, Coda matches your working style. Its seamless workspace connects to hundreds of your favorite tools including Salesforce, Jira, Asana, and Figma, helping your teams transform their rituals c right now and get six months off the team plan for startups for free. That's Coda, coda,.io/20vc and get six months off the team plan for free, coda.io/20vc. And speaking of tools that give you an edge, that's exactly what AlphaSense does for decision making. As an investor, I'm always on the lookout for tools that really transform how I work. Tools that don't just save time but fundamentally change how I uncover insights. That's exactly …